New VST user

[TAKnipe]

It has been a long journey to get to the point where I am ready to switch over to VST's. This is my VST build thread since I am building the pc from scratch and trying to do this on a reasonable budget. I will list the parts I am using and hopefully gain some valuable experience pass on some knowledge that other newbs venturing into VST's may gain from. So here we go:

Hardware

Chieftec Case L shape $69.99 Xoxide http://www.xoxide.com/chieftec-bravo-case-vesa.html
ECS GF8200a MB $64.99 - $20.00 Rebate TigerDirect http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3797665&CatId=3699
AMD Phenom 2.4 Ghz Quadcore $59.99 Reg 99.99 TigerDirect http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=5267165&CatId=3496
Delta 1010lt Sound Card $169.99 Ebay
AMD Fan $20.00 Works like a charm. I originally purchased a Thermaltake fan (Crap- would not fit the AMD board) Buy OEM Fans only, they have never failed me.

4 Gig of Ram DDR2 $????? Left over from another build I also has 4 sticks of 1 gig DDR2 so I added 2 sticks in the empty slots for 6 Gigs total.
HP DVD1040 $ Left over from another build

Acer 19" Monitor $119.99 TigerDirect http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=5682488&CatId=170

500Gig Hard drive 7200 rpm Western Digital Caviar Blue $59.99 Staples * Found out about this one on Slickdeals.net

PS2 Keyboard and Mouse, I want to keep the usb ports clear. Keyboard was free old Dell my company was throwing away. Mouse was PS2 Optical I purchased for $10.00

Software:
Microsoft Vista Home Premium 64 bit $99.99 on special New Egg at the Windows 7 Launch

Sonar Home Studio 6XL - Holdover from past use

Dimension Pro

VST Software - Superior Drummer 2.0

I will be utilizing my DTXtreme 3 and DTXtreme 2s transferring midi data through usb to the pc.

I will keep adding to this topic and hopefully put it in order so it makes some kind of sense. Wish me luck

[dauzman]

Good luck Tom....Keep us posted.... Id suggest getting a 1.5 drive these VST libraries can be very big....

[skadrummer]

You'll pull your hair out, but it is so worth it. I doubt you'll go back to a module.

[dschrammie]

Delta 1010lt Sound Card $169.99 Ebay


Wow...that is one serious breakout cable!

[Wotto]

I will watch this thread with great interest as I too will be 'pulling my hair out' in a couple of months also.......I have also found that out here in OZ....no-one , and I mean no-one in any drum shop has any decent knowledge of how Ekits and VST's work together.

There are some seriously cool and helpful guys in shops here but not in relation to this topic, they look at me like I have 3 heads if I ask them anything about it - so I gave up asking at shops.

[Scorch Whammin]

This will be an interesting thread to follow..as I too may (in the near future) venture into the VST world....keep us informed on how it goes.....:)

[Pink Led Rush]

Looks awesome, but seriously don't get Vista, get 7 or XP, I love my xp, but vista seriously sucks.

[TAKnipe]

Looks awesome, but seriously don't get Vista, get 7 or XP, I love my xp, but vista seriously sucks.


I need Vista 64 since i want to up the ram in a few weeks. When working with DAW's and sampled sounds you can never have enough ram. I have Vista tamed so I dont think it will become an issue. I use Windows 7 64 for everything else. The problems are that alot of these pieces of hardware and my DAW I have been having problems with using older programs in Win 7 64. T

[EDrum Pro]

Your crazy to do anything on any VISTA OS. Its sucks its a nightmare its all i hear. How can you support such a ****ed up operating system??? And how can you expect apps that are 32 bit to work on a 64bit OS. Come on dude you are smarter then that. Your so out of the loop its not funny. You tell me one record that's a hit that was recorded on a PC. One top ten hit you can't!!!!! all done on a MAC PLATFORM. Its all plug and play not plug and pray. You can run any PC OS on a APPLE MAC not the other way around. When you have a problem you call one place not 6 vendors that OEM there **** to HP or SONY or any PC computer. How many viruses have you had in 5 years? in 25 years using an Apple never once have I had one!!! You can't say that for any PC you've owned!! YOu could never convince me that a PC is the way to go only money is making you think this way. It makes no sense when it comes to making real music!!!

[skadrummer]

Who knew apples could make you crazy?

[CaTaPulT]

Quick..... hide the bananas! LOL :D
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[TAKnipe]

I would have used Linux if they had the software I needed. After I am done with the pc platform I will total it up and look at how much the equivalent mac set up would be. Might be an interesting comparison.

I would much prefer to be using Linux but this is what I have and I will go with it. Vista 64 sp2 is a stable platform, I have no reason to doubt that it wont work for what I need it for.


Check this out!

I wont have any viruses no matter what machine I use since its a dedicated machine that wont be going online.

[skadrummer]

Tom, my laptop is offline except for loading music programs. Its a good idea. You might need a 32 bit converter as some programs still don't support 64 bit.

[TAKnipe]

Thanks Marc, I appreciate all the help with this, I am hoping to make it work the first go round. T :)

[dschrammie]

TOM!!! YOU'RE THE NUTTIEST NUT-CASE IN THE WORLD! HOW CAN YOU POSSIBLY THINK THAT WAY?!! YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY DUMB DUMB DUMB IF YOU THINK YOU CAN DO THAT!!! I HAVEN'T USED IT MYSELF BY I KNOW IT SUCKS! DON'T BE SO DUMB! BLAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

Cripes.

[TAKnipe]

I am out here searching for answers just like everyone else, we all have different recipes for success. EDP has found his and hes just trying to help out a fellow edrummer. I appreciate the help but unfortunately as everyone else in this economy I am strapped for extra cash and have to go the way I can go. Trying to come up with the best solution I can for my situation. I am sharing my build no matter what happens I will post what I did and what happens including the good, bad & the ugly.

I admire Rich's passion for his equipment, anyone who reads this forum knows how Richie feels about Dauz pads and about Superior Drums and now about Apple. I hope he would share his build in a thread someday so we can learn what goes into a build from an Apple users perspective.


* I do want to say that I have always encouraged everyone here to speak their mind with no ramifications, so the fact that someone does it I dont want to beat him up over it since thats what this place is for.

** I did move out of my comfort zone by not using a asus motherboard on this build, the ECS board caught my eye and is a budget board with a ton of features and I wanted to make this work and illustrate that it could be done on a budget and still done correctly.

[skadrummer]

Tom, what do you expect from VST's? Do you want them for recording, playing out, pure pleasure? My choices in using Vst's are mainly for live playing. So far nothing is perfect. What I really need is a general purpose acoustic and old analog ekit that has fast load times

[TAKnipe]

Marc, I am hoping for the following:

1) Practice
2) Record
3) Something to report on here at EDF
4) Bring in new samples all the time
5) I want to find small tom samples of concert toms and in a multi sampled environment.

Last year I donated my kit for use at a friends studio to record an album with a band he was working for. It was my first introduction to Superior 2.0 I absolutely loved the tweakability. I also find that the stock sounds in any of the modules are too limiting for my taste. I love small concert toms and so far have been unable to reproduce those sounds with a module.

I would also want to gain some knowledge of VST's to report on here and also to be able to help out some people when they need it.

It seems that VST's are growing in popularity and EDF is about everything e drums. This is also about the site contests, trying something new for me will lead me in new directions and to see what can be done in the way of prizes and also what members are using and talking about. T

[Axe_Grinder]

I have 3 words,

1.) lead

2.) paint

3.) chips


@ Skadrummer - "Who knew apples could make you crazy" - Absolutely awesome!!!

Thanks for pointing us neophytes in the right direction. :)

Uhm chok Uhm chok Uhm chok :D

[Sal]

Twisted!

[dauzman]

Ive used various VST's on my Macbook 1.83 with 2GB ram and a 1.5 terrabyte drive... Its pretty straight ahead.. I open the VST's in Logic like EasyDrummer, Superior, BFD, RMX, Oceanway ect then its on. The stuff sounds Excellent.. I figured Id set up all the stuff even though my machine does not have near enough power to have room to move Cant have to many instruments up at once... I plan on moving my drives of libraries and applications into a faster machine with 8GB of ram which should fix alot of the limitations of my current machine...There are alot of ways to do this stuff ... We all have the choice of which road to take.... Ive been using Apple computers since 1985 so I must be crazy too...

[Scorch Whammin]

Ive used various VST's on my Macbook 1.83 with 2GB ram and a 1.5 terrabyte drive... Its pretty straight ahead.. I open the VST's in Logic like EasyDrummer, Superior, BFD, RMX, Oceanway ect then its on. The stuff sounds Excellent.. I figured Id set up all the stuff even though my machine does not have near enough power to have room to move Cant have to many instruments up at once... I plan on moving my drives of libraries and applications into a faster machine with 8GB of ram which should fix alot of the limitations of my current machine...There are alot of ways to do this stuff ... We all have the choice of which road to take.... Ive been using Apple computers since 1985 so I must be crazy too...

Me too!...been using macs since 2006...don't ever see myself going back to pc....so do you use anything extra for latency..or do you have any latency issues?

[TAKnipe]

I am trying it this way and hoping I have a little success, who knows what the next build will bring. I am hoping to learn quite a bit along the way. As a matter of fact this thread has taught me alot allready. If it helps one person then it will have accomplished it goal and I get to learn something new also. Stay tuned anyway it all just might explode also which will be entertaining in itself. :)

[dauzman]

I have to say it works great until you want it to do more then it wants to... I tried some stuff that just chokes everything and other stuff that inspires you to go the all software solution... Latency hasnt been a issue when playing drums ... You might save a few bucks on PC hardware but Id spend a bit more on a mac and save myself a whole lot of grief down the road with software....

[CaTaPulT]

The thing I don't get and please forgive me for my ignorance regarding Mac computers.
I believe the newer (a few years old now) OS is OSX, from what I heard this new apple OS is actually a shell sitting atop a Linux operating system. Now this is where I don't get it, if the included Mac software (SSD Kontakt) runs on a apple version of Linux, why can't it be ported to Linux whether it's running on a PC or Mac?
Food for thought perhaps, maybe it's just Microsoft's way of having a stranglehold around all our necks? Ewwwww, I said the bad word, Microsoft, I have to stop saying that word.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[dauzman]

Im pretty sure the Mac is Unix not Linux...

[WildWes]

Don't know anything about Mac's. Is there a particular model out there that would be perfect for using VST's/drum programs?

[CaTaPulT]

Yeah, the really expensive one! LOL :)
J/K.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[CaTaPulT]

Im pretty sure the Mac is Unix not Linux...

Hi Dan, thanks for clarifying that, but isn't Unix and Linux very similar in many respects and wouldn't it be easy for software developers to Port Unix stuff over to Linux?
If I recall, there was a free OS called FeeBSD that was a free version of a Unix like OS?
Oh well, the problem with PC's is not the hardware, it's the monopoly MS has over them which is most unfortunate.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[Pink Led Rush]

How come if anyone remotely even says the word computer it automatically turns into a Pc vs Mac debate? For all intents and purposes they both do the same job. Personally I've never used any Apple product and I have been just fine. lol My XP works just fine, my 7 works just fine, and hooo my Zune also works fine. Woah, didn't see that coming did you? Only reason I have not given Mac and Apple a try is there lack of formats and mostly their prices suck.

[dauzman]

I really dont know how close they are...Damn I just want the thing to work.....Id get the fastest one with the option of the most RAM that you can afford... You can get in the game for about 999.00 http://store.apple.com/us/product/FB950LL/A?mco=MTU0MzQ1NTg

[TAKnipe]

I just went to the Apple store online and I looked at the hardware schedule that they have and its almost exactly the same as PC. Ron reminded me last night that I could also build a Hackintosh if I wanted to.

Just to do a quick evaluation, the pc I built to do video editing on that cost me around $1,000 would have cost approximately 4 times that amount in a Mac. But I wouldnt have a Blu Ray drive or a HD Webcam.

God Bless Mac if they can get those prices. I have a bunch of friends that swear by Mac but I just dont have enough experience with them to justify spending 4 times the amount. To try them I will have to get a used Macbook and really try it before I can make any judgements.

[Axe_Grinder]

I don't believe I'm at any sort of a disadvantage having a PC and not a Mac for recording purposes. Personally I can't justify buying a Mac and it has nothing to do with not wanting to spend the extra buck. For what my last studio system cost I could have bought 3 Macs.

Bottom line, when I start to have issues with my system I'll consider it. Wait, no I won't... I'll fix or upgrade.

In Apples defense. If you just want to turn it on and go, they're great!

If you want something you can tweak to your hearts content, go pc.

"I'm a PC"! LMAO - But then I have a biased interest.

We are all entitled to our own opinions whether it's PC vs' Mac or Roland Vs' Yamaha.


I'll stick with windows.


@ -Pinkledrush - same thing happens with modules.


With all due respect

[evil1rox]

the old Mac vs PC debate doesn't hold as much water anymore.

Some more creative or intuitve software ahs been created for both platforms since that was a real concern.

I LOVED my Mac..I didn't love the software pricing, or the sluggish nature of the POWERPC chipset...or the fact I bought mine 2 months before the Intel chipset came out and I was left holding the bag.

PC = me from here on out... unless Mac pricing changes drasticly.

E

[Guinness]

Ya, avoid Vista if you can. I have a laptop with vista at work. It can be a bit buggy, but I've finally got it running pretty good. It is not the easiest OS to use. Win7 is much better. XP, of course, rules! :) But then again, XP won't recognize more than 4 gigs of ram. So...
But that said, I'd be surprised is VST needs more than 4 gigs. make sure the FSB is fast, and it won't be an issue. Also, I don't remember seeing a sound card in your list. Running sound off the board pulls resources, and usually, it's not High Quality. So, I'd get a Creative PCI card to run your sound instead. But then again, that may or may not be an issue with VST. (of which I don't know crap about. :) )

I'd suggest getting two HD's, instead of one. The first can run your OS, and the second can hold files (music, my docs, samples, etc...)

TigerDirect probably, like Newegg.com, has Mobo combo deals. Look for those. I'm not a fan of ECS boards. Asus, Abit, and Gigabyte are good boards (or at least they used to be.)

My two cents...

[ScutMonkey]

The thing I don't get and please forgive me for my ignorance regarding Mac computers.
I believe the newer (a few years old now) OS is OSX, from what I heard this new apple OS is actually a shell sitting atop a Linux operating system. Now this is where I don't get it, if the included Mac software (SSD Kontakt) runs on a apple version of Linux, why can't it be ported to Linux whether it's running on a PC or Mac?
Food for thought perhaps, maybe it's just Microsoft's way of having a stranglehold around all our necks? Ewwwww, I said the bad word, Microsoft, I have to stop saying that word.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

OSX is a heavily modified version of BSD, which is a Unix variant like Linux. Apple is extremely protective of their product architecture so I wouldn't expect anything which works on a Mac to be easily ported to Linux. Apple definitely isn't going to hand out that information so someone else can use it for free on Linux.

[CaTaPulT]

Thanks ScutMonkey.
That explains a lot. It's just unfortunate that certain really cool software can't be ported over to Linux since so many people use it now, I guess they just got fed up of MS's bullsh!t.
It's kind of like that old Murphy's law.....
"The thing I like so much about Standards is there are so many to chose from" LOL :)
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[skadrummer]

"The thing I like so much about Standards is there are so many to chose from" LOL :)
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<
I love it! Must use somewhere

[CaTaPulT]

LOL Skadrummer, I use it now and again, especially around computers! LOL :D
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[TAKnipe]

I finished the pc and thanks to Ron got it to work. I had to replace the Fan (After Market Thermal Take) would not fit the AM2 + socket and it caused the PC to shut down. That was fixed by me going to the store and purchasing an AMD oem fan. All is well and I am loading the the Vista 64 OS as I write this. Tom

[ScutMonkey]

Thanks ScutMonkey.
That explains a lot. It's just unfortunate that certain really cool software can't be ported over to Linux since so many people use it now, I guess they just got fed up of MS's bullsh!t.
It's kind of like that old Murphy's law.....
"The thing I like so much about Standards is there are so many to chose from" LOL :)
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

What it will take is someone who both loves Linux (and is an avid programmer) and music recording who is willing to backwards engineer something for Linux. The thing you have to remember about linux is that the people who make it work do it out of a love of Linux, programming, and the idea of free software. Which means they do it in their spare time out of joy. Not as a job to make a buck. As a result they're beholden to noone and you have to depend on the motivations of the goodness of their heart.

[TAKnipe]

So far I have Sonar 6 Home Studio XL 64 bit edition is in as well as Vista 64 all is well. All the Vista update went in well and the PC is running well. We shall see what tommorow brings and I will take some pics tommorow when everything is finally running. Thanks, T

[CaTaPulT]

Hi ScutMonkey.
I agree, most of everything for Linux is done by the user base, too bad companies can't be bothered to have a Linux version of their wares as well. I know some games do, they share the same files as the windows version, just different executables I guess.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[CaTaPulT]

Hi Tom.
Looking forward to seeing pics of the new machine.
I have a 32 bit version of Vista (not installed on any machine right now), does Vista 64 have the XP compatibility mode like Windows 7 Pro?
I hope this new machine works well for you.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<

[TAKnipe]

Hi Jack, Its funny I installed Sonar Homestudio and it asked me what version I wanted to install. So far for my Video Editing softwares have all run better on Vista 64 than on Windows 7 64. I probably am not the best person to ask overall since I am just getting into 64 bit computing. I like it so far much better because it opened up my RAM limitations to a great extent. On my Windows 7 machine some of my older programs that ran on XP 32 will not run on Windows 7 64. For the price I paid for Vista 64 it was a steal and it runs very well.

I will ask Axe if Vista 64 has the xp 32 compatibility mode and post it tommorow. Now I am interested to find out a bit more. I think you will like the setup I just put together, even the case is different.It was definitely fit the bill for use as a compact and sturdy for a tight drum setup. T :)



Hi Tom.
Looking forward to seeing pics of the new machine.
I have a 32 bit version of Vista (not installed on any machine right now), does Vista 64 have the XP compatibility mode like Windows 7 Pro?
I hope this new machine works well for you.
Take care

Regards: >>>> Jack <<<<